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 Platinum or Not
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| Author | Topic: Platinum or Not |
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venus Posts: 282 |
posted 05-04-2006 06:12 PM
  
[26-1036] Just got a huge platter today at a yard sale. It is trimmed in a silver metal. All the research I did on the china company turned up other patterns but not that one. But in all the listings I found no mention of silver. Gold yes and platinum. It is not painted on, but an actual (thin) wide band, with a pattern. Anyone know a quick way to tell the difference in silver and platinum? The platter was filthy, but once it was washed the metal really glowed and had no tarnish. The maker of the china is Cauldon LTD a/k/a Royal Caulon. The back stamp puts it 1905-1920. Would post a picture, but since it is more china than metal didn't know if it would be appropriate. IP: Logged |
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Ulysses Dietz Moderator Posts: 1265 |
posted 05-10-2006 08:30 AM
What it seems you have is a platter with a silver deposit band, although without a picture it's hard to be sure. All of the big china companies produced ceramic pieces that were decorated with electrolytically applied silver (silver deposit) AND with mechanically applied sterling rims (although one would expect these to be marked "STERLING"). I've never heard of platinum being used as an overlay or deposit. However, silver luster on ceramics is in fact platinum--but that is, as you say, painted on. IP: Logged |
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jersey Posts: 1203 |
posted 05-10-2006 06:51 PM
Hi Venus! My guess is it is a platinum band. Many companies use/used it on both glass & china. As with silver & gold trim the amount used is inconsequential to the piece. It is decorative. Don't put it in the dishwasher it will come off, after numerous washing. Wash with dishwashing liquid in lukewarm water don't rub hard & dry immediatly or else it could spot. Also, there may be a number or pattern name on the piece to ID it. Enjoy your piece. Jersey IP: Logged |
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venus Posts: 282 |
posted 05-11-2006 05:38 PM
Hi yourself jersey!  thanks for the imput, I would imagine that platter may well have a turkey on it in a few months. heh Not any of my china patterns, but it is bigger than most of my platters. White goes with lots too. I am fairly sure it is'nt silver, from researching that company. They had platinum and gold, but no mention of silver. It is not painted on but a band, sorta like a ummmm drawing a blank here. geez But anyhow it is a band, it has come off in one small place. It being off in that spot makes it very apparent it is a band. Again thanks to both of you for your help.IP: Logged |
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Dale Posts: 2132 |
posted 05-11-2006 08:04 PM
There are also metal bands that were put on pieces at a later date to protect the edge from chipping etc. These do show up from time to time. I don't know what they are made of, nor when they were in use. IP: Logged |
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venus Posts: 282 |
posted 05-12-2006 10:47 AM
interesting .... thanks dale IP: Logged |
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Ulysses Dietz Moderator Posts: 1265 |
posted 05-16-2006 01:43 PM
I am puzzled and would like to know the technique for applying the band. If it is electro-deposit, I can't believe it would be platinum, because of the cost of even this small amount of metal. Platinum (liquid) PAINTED on is commonplace in lots of china (the late lamented Lenox China did zillions of platinum decorated dishes); Lenox did in fact try to decorate dishes with silver pastework like their gold pastework, but it tarnished and did sell well for that reason. Platinum was the solution. But this is not the same technique as silver depost on glass or ceramic. IP: Logged |
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Dale Posts: 2132 |
posted 05-16-2006 02:44 PM
The ones I have seen worked like a gasket. They seemed to have been for commercial use, and probably dated pre 1929. IP: Logged |
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venus Posts: 282 |
posted 05-17-2006 08:20 AM
The backstamp dates it to agree with Dales dating. Have no idea what the price was for platinum at that time. The china company that made the platter china, is not inexpensive, or at least it isn't at this point in time. But this platter is not really "dainty" as in needing protection from chipping. I think that it was made for this china and came from the factory like that. The metal working has a pattern. There were numerous china patterns for this maker, which were unavailable for viewing from the site I went to. Looking at a place the decorative edge has come off, it shows some residue of the band left on the platter. The band is only somewhat thicker than silverplate, with a raised pattern. Not sure what the metal is, however considering the condition of the dish, if it was silver it would have been tarnished. . IP: Logged |
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FWG Posts: 845 |
posted 05-17-2006 01:05 PM
There seem to be two different features mixed in here. One, which Dale's postings seem to be referring to, is an added rim of solid metal that goes around a plate or platter to physically reinforce the edge. The few examples I have seen have appeared to be stainless steel, nickel-silver, or something like chromium-plated. The second, which venus's seems to be, is a decorative band applied around the rim of plates, platters, cups, bowls, etc. I've seen these done in gold and platinum, also silver and copper. I had always assumed they were done electrolytically, like silver overlay on glass, but prompted by Ulysses Dietz's reference to pastework (or paste work, two words) I see that there is another method, in which a paste is made of fine particles of the metal and a binder that is painted on; the binder burns off when the piece is fired, leaving the metal as a thin coating. In principle it should be possible to differentiate the two, especially if a part is worn away. But I don't know that anyone has ever done the analysis. My understanding of the plating technique is that an electroconductive paint is first applied in the desired design, and then the piece is plated; the metal only plates onto the areas painted with the special paint. If worn, one would be able to see the paint residue under where the silver had been. My guess would be that the pastework technique would not have that characteristic, but I can't say that from experience. I would note also that I have seen silver overlay, done by the electroplating technique, on ivory as well as glass and ceramics. [This message has been edited by FWG (edited 05-17-2006).] IP: Logged |
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venus Posts: 282 |
posted 05-17-2006 01:35 PM
A picture may solve this, will try to have it here by tomorrow. Good post FWG, thanks Well tomorrow came sooner that expected. Just got pc out of the shop, my pixels are not right so cannot tell a thing about these pictures. Hope you can. IP: Logged |
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