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 Value of 18th Century Teaspoons
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| Author | Topic: Value of 18th Century Teaspoons |
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Ginger Posts: 2 |
posted 02-05-2009 11:11 PM
  
Can anyone help me? My elderly parents are downsizing their home. Approximately 30 years ago my dad purchased three teaspoons that were authenticated to be made by Paul Revere, Thomas Revere, and Phillip Singh (sp?). These spoons have been in his safety deposit box since the day they were purchased. A relative has told my dad that due to the economy they are not as valuable as they use to be, and my dad now plans to get them out of the safety deposit box and GIVE them to this relative. I am afraid that my dad is being taken advantage of. My question is: Thanks for any help you can give me. IP: Logged |
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Scott Martin Forum Master Posts: 11520 |
posted 02-05-2009 11:33 PM
Hire a professional silver appraiser. Ask 10 people on the street what an appraisal is and how an appraisal is done and you will get 10 very different answers. The common thread heard is that an appraisal tells you "what it is worth" and is usually obtained by "asking/calling a dealer." In the simplest of terms this is generally correct. However, please don't contact us or any professional appraiser requesting a phone or email appraisal because if you need the appraisal for legal, tax, business, insurance, replacement, damage, loss, charitable gift, gift, estate, equitable distribution and/or other professional reasons a phone or an email appraisal will prove to be very inadequate. A professional appraiser cannot appraise your silver without personally inspecting it. Please don't waste your time asking for an appraisal based solely on your description or photographs. When you deal with a trained professional appraiser, one who belongs to one of the personal property appraisal associations (AAA, ASA, ISA), you will receive a documented comparative analysis as a written appraisal. A professionally written appraisal comes at the conclusion of a series of very specific and uniform steps which include: personal inspection, research, documentation and a comparative market study. A professionally written appraisal will conform to a standard called USPAP or Uniform Standards of Professional Appraisal Practice. Your appraisal when done properly can take a considerable amount of time so be prepared to compensate the professional appraiser accordingly. Also be sure that the appraiser specializes in the types of items being appraised. When you ask for and get a verbal or a "seat of the pants" written opinion this is not an appraisal, it is only a guesstimate. When asking a dealer for their opinion, remember they have to balance what they tell you. The dealers guesstimate usually falls somewhere between what they would buy it from you for, what they would sell it to you for and what they think will make you happy. This is not an objective opinion and so the declared value could be way off either way. IP: Logged |
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argentum1 Posts: 602 |
posted 02-06-2009 11:19 AM
This is a general rule of thumb and subject to interpretation. Those items which have been high value items in the past generally stay high value items. This is especially true of those items which have been coveted by collectors and even more so if there is some historical significance. Although the value may drop a bit I doubt it would drop enough to warrant giving it away. Is it verified by an accepted authority as being a Revere item or by someone who said they were an authority on Revere items but no creditials to back that statement up. [This message has been edited by argentum1 (edited 02-06-2009).] IP: Logged |
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swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 |
posted 02-06-2009 11:27 AM
quote: In a word, yes. IP: Logged |
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Kimo Posts: 1627 |
posted 02-06-2009 11:32 AM
Scott has given excellent advice - you really do need to take them to a professional and fully certified appraiser for a written appraisal. And he is also absolutely correct that you need to take them to an appraiser who is expert in the subject. For the kind of spoons you are referring to you really should not consider going to you local antiques dealer or even an ordinary professional appraiser you find in the yellow pages of your home town since such rarities as you describe take a real specialist professional appraiser who is well known for being among the major experts on works by these makers. One of the reasons for this is for every real piece of real Revere made silver there are countless fakes that are so well done that they fool most everyone but the most expert people who have handled and closely studied a large number of his real pieces. Even if the spoons have great age, famous maker's markings are very easy to add to silver made by common smiths. With a modest effort a skilled counterfeiter can turn an otherwise inexpensive silver object of approximately similar age into an object that appears to have been made by a famous smith, fooling the unsuspecting buyer into paying an enormous price for something that is not what it seems. The spoons are obviously your father's to do with as he pleases including giving them away, but he should at least know what it is that he has, whether they they are actually real like he has been led to think or does he have well made fakes and he was duped by either a knowing or unknowing seller, and what is their value in today's market which if they are real is considerable even with the economic downturn. [This message has been edited by Kimo (edited 02-06-2009).] IP: Logged |
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dragonflywink Posts: 993 |
posted 02-06-2009 12:08 PM
Subject hit home for me - as previously suggested, try to keep your folks from being taken advantage of - is there some reason for them to trust this relative's opinion? Sometimes, advanced age will blur judgment, and interest from someone will be interpreted as "caring". My cousin is trying to handle a family situation now where our aunt has already been robbed blind by "friends", despite my mother and others attempting to help, while she is quite elderly, looks like they'll now be responsible for her death (before whatever funds they've left her are wiped out by a nursing home). Good luck in what can be a frustrating situation. ~Cheryl IP: Logged |
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jersey Posts: 1203 |
posted 02-06-2009 05:30 PM
Hello Ginger! If there is authentic paperwork with the spoons, perhaps taking them to a Museum first might work, I would think they could help to properly direct you. I would also get more than one appraisal. Also re: Philip Syng there were 2. In my humble opinion, Revere is an icon in the silver world. I do not think the economy would ever factor in regarding price. Maybe for the ordinary everyday collector, but never for the high rollers. If when you find out the true value, offer (if you wish), to sell them to the relative, if you think that would help. Let us know how you make out. Good Luck. Jersey
[This message has been edited by jersey (edited 02-06-2009).] IP: Logged |
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Clive E Taylor Posts: 450 |
posted 02-06-2009 06:41 PM
From an English perspective, and I suspect it's the same in the States. Its true to say that in general antiques are not selling as well as they did pre-crunch and are often fetching less. However the upper end of the market, to which if your spoons are "right", they belong to,is actually going up. Real investment pieces are being actively sought as a refuge from inflation, possible bank collapse, stock & real estate market insecurity, and very low interest rates. If I had half a million dollars in cash at present, my inclination would be to put at least half into "blue chip" antique silver. As many people are doing this, prices are going up - if only on the top material. IP: Logged |
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argentum1 Posts: 602 |
posted 02-06-2009 07:36 PM
A bit of truth - There were THREE riders on that fateful night. Paul Revere a silversmith, William Dawes a Tanner and a Physician Samuel Prescott. Had Longfellow chosen one of the other two for his famous poem Paul Revere silver may well have lost out on its current value. IP: Logged |
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Ginger Posts: 2 |
posted 02-06-2009 09:16 PM
Dear Posters: Thank you to everyone who took the time to respond to my posting. I’ve been informed by my mother that my father met my relative at the bank today and turned over his entire antique silverware collection. (Dad had several other very nice pieces in addition to the ones that I specifically mentioned.) Therefore, my opportunity to have his collection professionally appraised is no longer available – assuming I was able to obtain Dad’s permission to do it in the first place. I want to sincerely thank everyone who took the time to read my posting and respond to it. I appreciate the time and knowledge that you so willingly shared. My husband is a firearms dealer who specializes in antique guns. Heretofore, I’ve always been rather annoyed at what I considered the inordinate amount of time he spends on gun forums answering questions of strangers that are very similar to the one that I asked of you. I now realize just how comforting it is to be able to tap into the expertise of people like you without ever having to leave my home. I guess I’ll have to stop griping about him coming to bed so late. Thank you again. Ginger IP: Logged |
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swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 |
posted 02-06-2009 09:54 PM
quote: When the three riders were confronted by the British, Revere surrendered and spent the night in jail. The other two made a run for it and escaped, but Dawes was unhorsed, so Prescott was the only one to complete the ride, but either Longfellow couldn't find a rhyme for his name, or wasn't interested in historical accuracy. IP: Logged |
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jersey Posts: 1203 |
posted 02-06-2009 10:08 PM
Ginger! Hopefully your parents will never need the money that these items may have offered them in some small way to help care for them if need be & that your relatives will keep that in mind. Remember too. What goes around comes around! God Bless! Jersey IP: Logged |
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argentum1 Posts: 602 |
posted 02-06-2009 10:17 PM
Jersey, I have found over the years that what goes around HARDLY ever comes around instead the greedy(deleted expletive)just get greedier and increase their net worth. I wish it were other but I am afraid not. IP: Logged |
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FWG Posts: 845 |
posted 02-07-2009 09:32 AM
As one of my late, lamented colleagues used to say in the reverse situation, after on ehad done something good for someone: "You will be rewarded. Not in this life...." IP: Logged |
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jersey Posts: 1203 |
posted 02-07-2009 07:22 PM
Argentum1 & FWG! Maybe it's the Italian in me, but sooner or later.........sometimes MUCH much later, and as the song goes.....One way or another.....it does come back-at-cha! Toodles! Jersey IP: Logged |
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ahwt Posts: 2334 |
posted 02-11-2009 09:43 PM
Boston 1775 provides an interesting explanation of the relationship between Paul Revere and William Dawes and why Paul Revere stood out in later stories about the ride. The book “The Tipping Point” by Malcolm Gladwell also provides an insight as to the importance of Paul Revere in the famous ride. Both show that the presence Paul Revere had in his community and his role in his society after the revolution played a major role in how he is remembered. Another factor in his importance in the retelling of the story may be that he was the only rider who left a tangible product – his silver. This was something that later generations could draw on to have a connection with the past. This is very reason why silver with a good makers mark costs more than an unmarked piece and why silver with a good story brings even more. I go out of my way to visit the Warner Museum in North Port, AL because the owner, Mr Warner, has several Paul Revere objects and he is more than happy to let one hold them. Another aspect of Paul Revere’s life is also interesting. His numerous engravings were mostly copies of English prints as he was not an artist. Perhaps his most famous engraving, “The Bloody Massacre”, was a plagiarized copy of a work by Henry Pelham a fellow Bostonian. Revere’s engraving was the first to be advertised and sold; much to the dismay of Mr. Pelham as the market value of his work went down. William Kloss has an interesting account of this engraving in the book “Becoming a Nation – Americana from the Diplomatic Reception Rooms of the U.S. Department of State.” Copying the work of others, particularly popular English authors, became a way of life for American publishing companies well into the 19th century and in this context Paul Revere’s actions were not out of the ordinary for his time. IP: Logged |
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Hose_dk Posts: 400 |
posted 02-12-2009 03:10 PM
I have a different point of view. You ask whether someone is taking advantage of your parents? Look at it this way - have you ever told your dad that you appreciate the spoons and that you will be very pleased to carry the legacy for the next decade or two? Before bringing the silver with the story onto your children. It could be the case that your father have found someone - to whom the dollar value is unimportant, A person that will carry the spoons into the next generation. And thereby look upon the spoons as your father have done - part of your history. I my world - If I had a key from 1700, and someone had a piece of furniture from 1700 but missing the key. I would give him the key - free of charge - even to a total stranger. I don't know if this is the case - but is it possible? IP: Logged |
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silverhunter Posts: 704 |
posted 02-13-2009 05:56 AM
My son sometimes looking at my little collection of silver/silverplated items and saying nice herritage but I hope to life for a while. IP: Logged |
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Hose_dk Posts: 400 |
posted 02-13-2009 01:57 PM
My daughter (28 years) once sayd. Please mark anything of value - before we should clean up after you. I will never say to her that I give some items for other members of the family - members that will take care of. IP: Logged |
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jersey Posts: 1203 |
posted 02-13-2009 07:34 PM
Hose_dk! My children say the same thing. The only problem is I never get around to doing it as I should. I do however, have a list of friends that are knowledgeable for them to call upon if needed. Very few things I have, & they know what they are, should not be sold. The other thing is if they need the money to bury me in grand style that's OK. OR like my Dad said, just put me in the yard with my dogs. Maybe we should will it to the Forum members, (just kidding maybe). Have a great weekend. Jersey IP: Logged |
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