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Author Topic:   #333 Spoons
Paul Lemieux

Posts: 1768
Registered: Apr 2000

iconnumber posted 03-12-2002 02:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Paul Lemieux     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Pictured are two Aesthetic style spoons by Gorham; one has a leaf/branch motif, and the other is in the form of some kind of Japanese style paddle? Both are just over 5" long, and both are totally hand wrought. Interestingly, both are numbered 333. Because both have the same number, are the same size, and from the same period, I think they must be from some handmade line of spoons. However, I have not seen any other 333 spoons, or any documentation of such a set. Also, I do not know the function of these spoons (coffee spoons, perhaps?). Does anybody have any further information or ideas?

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FredZ

Posts: 1069
Registered: Jun 99

iconnumber posted 03-12-2002 03:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FredZ     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I don't believe I can help you Paul, Though I believe they are coffee spoons. Could you possibly photgraph the back of the paddle spoon? It appears as if the two wires of the handle penetrate the bowl and then wrap around the back and onto the front again.... A side shot might be nice to see if the band that holds the wires also wraps on the sides and back.

I think it would be great to have a techniques and manufacture process section of this forum to discuss how an item was made.

I will keep my eyes open for other 333 marked spoons and I will document them for you.

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Paul Lemieux

Posts: 1768
Registered: Apr 2000

iconnumber posted 03-12-2002 04:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Paul Lemieux     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Fred--here are some more closeups of the spoon's construction. You are correct, the wire does penetrate the bowl. The two bands in the middle and bottom of the handle are actually tightly coiled bands of very thin gauge wire. It is a neat item that must have been fun to make.

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FredZ

Posts: 1069
Registered: Jun 99

iconnumber posted 03-12-2002 07:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FredZ     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Paul, Thank you ever so much... That is exactly what I wanted to see. interesting the way the back of the bowl was cut with tabs that were bent down so that the coil would be locked in place. I would not be supprized to learn that the coils were not even soldered in place, just wrapped and the ends tucked in. It does look like it was fun to construct.

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wev
Moderator

Posts: 4095
Registered: Apr 99

iconnumber posted 03-12-2002 09:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for wev     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Any idea of a date on these? There was a big influx of African inspired design in the early 20's as a result of the first big Cubist show in New York (sort of like the Tut mania about the same time). The construction of the wrapped wire spoon is very similar to authentic native construction techniques.

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Paul Lemieux

Posts: 1768
Registered: Apr 2000

iconnumber posted 03-13-2002 12:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Paul Lemieux     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My guess for the date was the late 1880s or so.

Does anyone know exactly what the "paddle" spoon is supposed to represent?

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Richard Kurtzman
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Posts: 759
Registered: Aug 2000

iconnumber posted 02-27-2010 02:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Richard Kurtzman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Okay, six years later here's the info.

These spoons are part of a twelve piece set of Ice Cream Spoons made in extremely limited quantities in 1883. In addition to the number 333 some of these spoons are marked with the letter P, the date letter for 1883.

The placing of a date mark on flatware was seldom done by Gorham.

Some wild silver was made in the early 1880s and this set is certainly that.

Below is a Gorham photograph of the complete set.

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Scott Martin
Forum Master

Posts: 11377
Registered: Apr 93

iconnumber posted 02-27-2010 03:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Scott Martin     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you Richard.

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Polly

Posts: 1939
Registered: Nov 2004

iconnumber posted 03-01-2010 10:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Polly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Wow, that set is heart-stoppingly wacky! Has anyone here ever seen any more of them in person?

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doc

Posts: 712
Registered: Jul 2003

iconnumber posted 03-02-2010 02:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for doc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have not seen spoons of this style, but I was recently doing a show and a man brought in a Gorham serving piece that had similar wire "stitching" on the handle. The bowl of the serving piece was shaped similarly to an oyster server, but was the size of a large salad server. The "bowl" was on the side of the handle, similar to several of the spoons in the photo, and the handle was faux bois. Couldn't get him to sell it to me, so I don't have a photo.

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Richard Kurtzman
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Posts: 759
Registered: Aug 2000

iconnumber posted 03-03-2010 02:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Richard Kurtzman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Polly, The answer to your question is yes, and they are "wackier" than they appear in the photo.

doc, Is this what you saw?

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vathek

Posts: 962
Registered: Jun 99

iconnumber posted 03-03-2010 02:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for vathek     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It appears that the Victorians staid demeanor was offset by their silver designs. While not a big silver designer, Christopher Dresser's stuff could still pass for pretty modern.

[This message has been edited by vathek (edited 03-04-2010).]

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doc

Posts: 712
Registered: Jul 2003

iconnumber posted 03-03-2010 07:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for doc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Richard-that's exactly what I saw-just the the "fork" part. What can you tell me about the set?

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Richard Kurtzman
Moderator

Posts: 759
Registered: Aug 2000

iconnumber posted 03-05-2010 07:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Richard Kurtzman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It's a salad set dating from the early 1880s. These sets came in several diffrent sizes and a macaroni server was also made in this design. The salad set pieces pop up from time to time, but the macaroni server is rarely seen.

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Polly

Posts: 1939
Registered: Nov 2004

iconnumber posted 03-06-2010 12:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Polly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Wow, I love those! Don't you wish the designer had left a diary explaining what he had in mind?

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Paul S

Posts: 32
Registered: Dec 2000

iconnumber posted 03-19-2010 06:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Paul S     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Seeing the spoons Paul L. posted reminded me of a really interesting set I had several years ago. They are very similar to the ice cream spoons he shows, but these were very small (around 3 inches) and came in a fantastic silk lined fan shaped box. It had the original label on the bottom saying they were coffee spoons and the price of $14.00. The spoons were interesting but I thought the box was fantastic and really made the set. The only way I knew they were Gorham is the box said "GORHAM MANUFACTURING UNION SQUARE NEW YORK"

Kinda wish I hadn't sold them now....

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doc

Posts: 712
Registered: Jul 2003

iconnumber posted 03-19-2010 07:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for doc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I love the box!

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jersey

Posts: 1203
Registered: Feb 2005

iconnumber posted 03-19-2010 09:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jersey     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hello Paul S.

I know where the box & spoons are now, and not on the infamous auction site.
Or at least an identical one.
No, I do not have them.

Jersey

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