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 SMP Silver Salon Forums
 American Sterling Silver
 matches holder
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| Author | Topic: matches holder |
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Raf Steel Posts: 94 |
posted 03-31-2006 06:29 AM
  
For some time I have a matches holder by Tiffany, it is fully marked, and it has a 'T' for I believe Charles Tiffany (1898?). Does anyone know the pattern name of this item? (reads "STERLING 925-1000 T", sorry for the poor picture quality) The backside is just plain, with the same border. IP: Logged |
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William Hood Posts: 271 |
posted 03-31-2006 10:09 AM
The incuse "T" indicates the piece was made during that period of time between the death of Edward C. Moore, chief designer and head of the silver department, and the death of Charles L. Tiffany, president of Tiffany & Co., i.e., between 1891 and 1902. Most items like this match safe did not have a pattern name, only a number. The pattern number is the one to the left of the word "MAKERS"; the number to the right is the order number. IP: Logged |
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outwest Posts: 390 |
posted 04-01-2006 12:42 AM
It seems a very forward pattern for that time (Tiffany usually was). I have a little match safe, too and it even has the original hand dipped matches in it. They're very cute little hand made wooden matches. You match safe is a very nice piece. IP: Logged |
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Dale Posts: 2132 |
posted 04-01-2006 01:08 AM
I suspect the design would have been considered American Indian when new. Probably today it would by 'Native American' style. Great piece, thanks for sharing. IP: Logged |
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William Hood Posts: 271 |
posted 04-01-2006 11:03 AM
Outwest, you were no doubt thinking that this was an Art Deco design, but I agree with Dale that it is Native American. During this time period, Tiffany's art director, Paulding Farnham, was designing some of his greatest pieces in this style--such as the Cincinnati Art Museum - Tiffany Loving Cup. IP: Logged |
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outwest Posts: 390 |
posted 04-01-2006 01:46 PM
Ah, yes, I was thinking it art deco. But, it certainly looks Native American,too. Thanks for the link. IP: Logged |
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Raf Steel Posts: 94 |
posted 04-02-2006 08:22 AM
I was thinking of the more stylised version of the art nouveau, which would be early. I'm glad to know it is native american in style, this makes it very interesting and the only piece in my collection with such an influence!: I based my date of 1898 on the pattern numbers and dates in the Carpenter book (p.261). Is it 'safe' to use these number/date relations or not? Would this have been a design by Farnham? Or did he leave the small items in the care of the unknown designers of the firm? IP: Logged |
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Dale Posts: 2132 |
posted 04-02-2006 01:58 PM
In old catalogs, frequently smoking related items are in a separate section from the general silver items. Which might suggest that this was retailed by tobbacanists. In general, the design of an item depends on the 'line' it is part of. Smoking accessories include match safes, cigar holders, humidors, smoking stands, lighters and ashtrays. In any particular line there is a standard design motif which is then adapted to the particular needs and sizes of an item. So, no doubt, Farnyham would have paid attention to all things, including the smallest. IP: Logged |
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William Hood Posts: 271 |
posted 04-02-2006 07:14 PM
Raf Steel, I am not sure where or how Carpenter obtained the hollowware data he tabulated on pp. 260-261 (1978 ed.). I tend to think of them as approximations. Also, a pattern number was assigned when the pattern was first designed/made. A piece in a given pattern made much later will still bear the original pattern number. It gets even less precise with flatware. An incuse (punched) "date letter" such as "T" indicates the time range when the piece was actually made. But a raised date letter (i.e., one incorporated in the die) indicates when the die was made, not when the piece was actually stamped using this die. I can vouch for the fact that in the table re flatware on p. 261, some of the pattern numbers don't match the dates at all. Dale, Tiffany & Co. began to retail its flatware in select jewelry stores only in the 1950s, and I am not sure that they ever retailed hollowware outside their own stores. (Tiffany's first domestic outlet outside NYC--in San Francisco--was not opened until 1963.) Am certain they would never have permitted anything to be sold by a tobacconist. There are no records to substantiate how "hands-on" Farnham was, but it seems likely that as art director he greatly influenced what lesser designers produced. IP: Logged |
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Raf Steel Posts: 94 |
posted 04-03-2006 11:55 AM
Mr. Hood and Dale, thank you both for your elaborate responses. The more you know about silver, the more you are left in doubts ... IP: Logged |
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Ulysses Dietz Moderator Posts: 1265 |
posted 04-05-2006 11:39 AM
By the way, does anyone know when such match safes, or Vesta cases, went out of use (i.e. when safety matches were introduced?). The design of this certainly makes sense for the dates suggested by the T mark. It coincides with all of the Indian material produced by Tiffany, both silver and jewelry, for the World's Fairs from 1893-1904. Aside from the form, the aesthetic of this would have had a very limited shelf-life, unlike some Tiffany things (such as "English King" flatware, which lasted forever). IP: Logged |
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doc Posts: 728 |
posted 04-05-2006 01:45 PM
The change didn't happen with the invention of the safety match, which occurred in the 1850's, because you still needed a place to strike them. The real change occurred at the turn of the century when matchbooks were invented. Originally patented in 1889, they didn't become readily available until the late 1890's-there was a patent fight between the original patent holder and Diamond Match, which also claimed to have invented them. IP: Logged |
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outwest Posts: 390 |
posted 04-06-2006 01:17 AM
Here's my silver enameled advertising match case (sorry, haven't polished it lately). Is it called a vesta, too? It is 1860-85. I know this because the other side says, "Compliments of John Swasey Co, etc." and he was in business during that time (married Miles Greenwoods daughter). These are what I would call safety matches since the silver box incorporates a striker. I've always thought it was terribly cute with the original hand dipped matches and the smooth wood sticks. When I was a kid about 10 I actually lit one of the matches and oh, boy, did I catch hell for that! IP: Logged |
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Dale Posts: 2132 |
posted 04-06-2006 01:21 AM
It is my understanding that match holders of this type are still made today. They are used by sportsmen who might need to light a fire. Even though book matches were available, there exists a need for a safe dry container for matches. IP: Logged |
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outwest Posts: 390 |
posted 04-06-2006 01:29 AM
I have a waterproof match holder that we always take backpacking and camping. It is a small plastic tube with a waterproof rubber screw on seal. You can also buy wax dipped wooden matches that are water proof. These little cases weren't water proof though. Weren't they just a stylish carrying box? IP: Logged |
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