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Silver basket, without mark

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Author	Topic: Silver basket, without mark
bcotter8 unregistered	posted 02-03-2003 08:05 AM My mom has a silver basket that is said to have been given to my 5th great grandfather before he travelled from the states to Canada, it is said he led Loyalists from Maine up to Canada, but we don't know if this is the area he was living in at the time, around 1783-85. It was given by his neighbours. There is a mark of 0 over a 801 on the bottom edge, and handwritten numbers 8681W on the bottom. How can I find out who made it without a mark? It has a punched out design with what looks like a braided handle. IP: Logged
Stephen Posts: 625 Registered: Jan 2003	posted 02-03-2003 11:38 AM What makes you think it is plated? Do you see copper showing through or at the edges? Does it tarnish? If the above answers are yes, and if it was made around 1783-1785, one possibility is that it is Old Sheffield plate (i.e. fused plate,) made in Sheffield, England. Much of this was unmarked. Your description sounds like a pierced basket with a wirework (drawn wire) handle. Piercing and wirework were both used when producing Old Sheffield plate. But... without any maker's mark on the piece, and without photos and a little more information, I wouldn't swear that it is. Can you post a photo of the basket and a close-up photo of the marks? I wouldn't want to mislead you. IP: Logged
bcotter8 unregistered	posted 02-04-2003 11:47 AM There was copper showing through the silver and it does tarnish. My mom had it resilvered many many years ago. There looks to be a mark on the bottom under the handle. It could be a 4, * or triangle. None of the pictures I took of it came out clear. Thanks for any help you might be able to give on its origins. Beth IP: Logged
Stephen Posts: 625 Registered: Jan 2003	posted 02-05-2003 11:44 AM Thanks for the info, photos do help! Just a few more questions: Is the "4, * or triangle" mark on the underside of the handle itself, or concealed so that you wouldn't normally see it? Could the "O" mark be a circle with something in it? Have you tried cleaning the small marks? A lot of times these are tarnished or filled with old polish and difficult to make out. A round wooden toothpick with a little water and some silver polish usually works for me. A strong light and a good magnifying glass are a must. When it was replated, was the handle also replated? In the photo, it looks like the handle is a different color. Everything still points to an English origin. [This message has been edited by Stephen (edited 02-05-2003).] IP: Logged
bcotter8 unregistered	posted 02-07-2003 11:47 AM The picture of the full basket showed it being a brassy colour, it is silver. The 4, * or triangle are directly on the underside of the basket where the handle is attached. I think the reslivering might have filled some of it in. And it is bumpy like it was hammered into shape. I think the handle may be solid silver as it has never had anything show through it and I don't think it was replated, will have to ask mom about that. There are many creases in the handle and some black tarnish is still deep in them, so that could be why the colouring looks different. The 0 is definitely a '0', with nothing in it. Thanks for getting back to me IP: Logged
Stephen Posts: 625 Registered: Jan 2003	posted 02-07-2003 11:04 PM I can't figure out who made it, because it doesn't appear to have a maker's mark. The origin appears to be English because of the "4,*, or triangle" mark. This would be a workman's mark and these kinds of marks were not used on American silverplate. Also, Old Sheffield plate was not made in America. If the handle is original to the piece and made in England, it is not solid silver because there are no hallmarks. If the original handle tests as sterling, the piece is Old Sheffield plate. If the handle tests as pure silver the piece is Old Sheffield plate that has been replated or electro plate made 1840 or later. Also, if the basket itself (the bottom piece) is Old Sheffield plate, the decoration in the center of the basket would have been chased rather than engraved and would show through to the bottom side. If it doesn't, the bottom piece is electroplate and made 1840 or later. You might want to have piece examined by someone who specializes in Old Sheffield plate to determine if the handle is original and whether or not the piece is Old Sheffield plate. Stories attached to family heirlooms are not always factual and the piece may not be as old as you think. Hope this helps! [This message has been edited by Stephen (edited 02-08-2003).] IP: Logged
bcotter8 unregistered	posted 02-11-2003 07:00 AM Thanks for all of your help. I will try and find someone who knows about silver. As we are trying to figure out just how old it really is. Could it have been made by a silversmith, that knew the family, as a gift and therefore wouldn't put a mark on it, as it wasn't sold? IP: Logged
Stephen Posts: 625 Registered: Jan 2003	posted 02-11-2003 03:17 PM Nothing about this piece indicates to me that it is solid silver or hand crafted by a smith. Some of the finishing may have been done by hand, but everything indicates that it was manufactured by a plater. Have you considered an appraisal? IP: Logged

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