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tline3open  EMDS EP--Unknown manufacturer, help?

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Author Topic:   EMDS EP--Unknown manufacturer, help?
JBree

Posts: 25
Registered: May 2003

iconnumber posted 05-26-2003 12:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for JBree     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi, Going thru material left by my Dad, I found a set of spoons marked EMDS EP. The EMD and EP are fairly simple block letters and the S is in fancy script. They are all inset, the EMDS in separate squares with cutoff corners, the EP is in an oval perpendicular to the others. I'm assuming EP is electroplate and I'm guessing that the fancy S might means sons or and sons, but I have no evidence to support that. They may have been acquired in Kentucky or Connecticut. I'm unable so far to id the manufacturer; any help appreciated. Jim

[This message has been edited by JBree (edited 05-26-2003).]

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Stephen

Posts: 625
Registered: Jan 2003

iconnumber posted 05-27-2003 12:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Stephen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Welcome to the forums.

These sound like English plater's marks. The "S" could stand for Sheffield, and "EMD" could stand for E.M. Dickinson. I haven't found a photo of the mark you describe so this is just a guess.

Do you know how old the spoons are or what the pattern is? If not, a photo of the spoon handle would help to give you a better answer.

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JBree

Posts: 25
Registered: May 2003

iconnumber posted 05-27-2003 01:39 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for JBree     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
HI STEPHEN, Thanks so much for the quick reply. I photographed the marks and one of the table spoons today, need to develop and scan. All of the other material, mostly Rodgers, is American so the possibility of English is quite interesting. Re the age, guessing 1890's to 1930's. Will add the pic asap. Tx again. Jim

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Stephen

Posts: 625
Registered: Jan 2003

iconnumber posted 05-27-2003 12:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Stephen     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Re: "the other material, mostly Rodgers, is American".

There is/was no known American plater named "RODGERS". I suspect what you have is marked something "Rogers" something. Am I wrong?

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JBree

Posts: 25
Registered: May 2003

iconnumber posted 05-27-2003 07:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for JBree     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Sorry, my wife is a Rodgers, the silverplate is Rogers: Wm Rogers Mfg Co and 1847 Rogers Brothers (mostly 'Vingage', I believe), also Embassy, Oneida Tudor Plate, Old Company Plate, National Silver Co, New England Silver Plate, and a few wonderful old dinner knives (c1860?) with broad blades but no markings, an S Kirk and Son Sterling baby spoon that's a beauty, another marked King Edward Silverplate NSC (both look fairly recent, 1930-40's),as well as the EMDS/EP spoons. A few other odd items, but that's the flatware. Jim

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doobees

Posts: 277
Registered: Jan 2003

iconnumber posted 06-03-2003 05:24 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for doobees     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Jim, I contacted the Sheffiels assay office about your EMD. Heres what the librarian there had to say about your piece:
quote:

"Not sure about this one.

The spoons are certainly electroplate - hence the EP, as your friend suspected.

It may be the mark of E.M. Dickinson, of Sheffield. This firm was in business from 1889-1923, & they did make cutlery & flatware - so could well have made these spoons. However, they usually stamped their goods with their full name - E.M. DICKINSON, SHEFFIELD.

The 'S' in fancy script often appears on electroplate - it usually seems to denote Sheffield, though Birmingham manufacturers sometimes used it as well.

Perhaps they hoped people would think it stood for 'Silver'?!

I have also have a look in Dorothy T. Rainwater's 'Encyclopedia of American Silver Manufacturers', but can't see anything similar there.


This seems to back up Stephen's guess of the same maker. I guess we can't know for sure though, if even the Sheffield assay office is not absolutely certain.

Hope it helped smile


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Suzanne D

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JBree

Posts: 25
Registered: May 2003

iconnumber posted 06-04-2003 12:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for JBree     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Suzanne, That sounds like a lot of work! Greatly appreciated. The closest thing to EMDS in form are the electroplate designations from SilverMine:

"If it has the numbers '900' '850' '800' or similar then this would be the silver content (per thousand) of the silver alloy used. Much European silver is made from this grade of alloy. If it has the letters "EPNS" "EP" "EPBM" "EPC" "SP"or "A1", 'Made in England' or 'England' then it is silverplate or electroplate."

EMDS vs EPNS etc sounded promising..but it isn't right. I'm surprised that the well known English knife maker made flatware that somehow it wound up in a Kentucky boy's kitchen drawer!

Tx again,
Jim

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doobees

Posts: 277
Registered: Jan 2003

iconnumber posted 06-04-2003 04:26 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for doobees     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Glad to be of help... smile

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Suzanne D

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clarissas1976
unregistered
iconnumber posted 08-14-2003 04:43 AM           Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The spoons are American .. made by a company called Gorham silver ,, they are silverplate.. made approx 1890 ..try one of pattern matching sites as they offer a free pattern search .. Hope this helps..

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Anuh

Posts: 190
Registered: Jan 2003

iconnumber posted 08-14-2003 12:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Anuh     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by clarissas1976:
The spoons are American .. made by a company called Gorham silver ,, they are silverplate.. made approx 1890 ..try one of the pattern matching sites as they offer a free pattern search .. Hope this helps..

Just so we are all learning from the same book, can you tell us where you came by the information that EMDS was a mark used by Gorham?

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Anuh

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JBree

Posts: 25
Registered: May 2003

iconnumber posted 08-17-2003 01:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for JBree     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi clarissas1976, I just got an answer back from Replacements.com re EMDS that they don't recognize the mark. Now I'm really intrigued as to how you put EMDS together with an American manufacturer, which makes more logistical sense than British, and even more so, specifically Gorham! Thanks again, Jim

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Anuh

Posts: 190
Registered: Jan 2003

iconnumber posted 08-22-2003 09:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Anuh     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by JBree:
I found a set of spoons marked EMDS EP. The EMD and EP are fairly simple block letters and the S is in fancy script. They are all inset, the EMDS in separate squares with cutoff corners, the EP is in an oval perpendicular to the others. I'm assuming EP is electroplate and I'm guessing that the fancy S might means sons or and sons, but I have no evidence to support that.

Re-reading your original post, Jim, and it makes me think that the S mark COULD be something else entirely. I don't know what, but maybe looking at it from that perspective would give us a different viewpoint. ;-D

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Anuh

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