posted 07-27-2017 05:32 PM            

Anyone recognize the mark?

posted 08-02-2017 12:44 AM            

The mark looks cast not struck.

Perhaps these were made as a special order after the original dye's were exhausted? Or by a different maker to match. Without the dyes, they would sand cast copies from the original sterling pieces.

I have seen sterling things copied in a base metal and then silver plated. Its an inexpensive way to replace missing family heirlooms.

posted 08-02-2017 12:02 PM            

"It has an odd mark on the back of the bowl, looks like maybe a dragon or an insect in a shield?"

posted 08-02-2017 02:22 PM            

But I'm pretty sure these spoons are handmade, not cast:

-The scrolly edge at the top of the bowl differs very slightly from spoon to spoon, as if cut by hand
-In each handle, the four individual leaves and the cattail are soldered together, then soldered onto the round part, which is then soldered to the long cylindrical part of the handle; I can see very tiny bits of solder
-The place where the cylindrical part of the handle bends and tapers to connect to the bowl varies from spoon to spoon, clearly handmade
-The pointy indentation in the bowl varies from spoon to spoon, especially on the back
-The bowl edges show tiny raspy marks, as if cut with a saw or file

So I think some of the pieces were cast--the leaves, cattail, and the round bit right under the cattail--and some were handmade or partly handmade (the bowls and the main part of the handle). Then everything was put together and finished by hand. The work is very skillful.

I wish I were a good enough photographer, with a good enough camera, to show these details.

I think the mark looks cast because it was stamped on after the stippled matte surface treatment was applied. I also want to say it's stamped on a slightly different spot on each spoon, but I'm not 100% sure of that.

posted 08-02-2017 05:04 PM            

I've been doing a mental exercise about how I would make a copy from the original.

This is what I came up with:

• I would make 2 positive plaster castings of the original spoon.

• I would separate the bowl and top from the center bar into separate plaster castings. Then make adjustments to the bowl and top. For example, eliminate the bar from the bowl plaster casting.

• Now that I have master forms for the bowl and top, I would next make re-usable (rubber?) negative forms for creating wax positive forms.

• I would use the wax positive forms to sand cast the bowl and the top with a base metal.

• resulting in:

• Next I would then prepare ready made (purchased) base metal bar for attaching the top and bowl. Split the bowl end of the bar and on the other end make a short tang for attaching the top.

• Drill a small tang sized hole in the base of the top and assemble the separate pieces for soldering and then solder.

• Clean things up and then silver pate.

posted 08-02-2017 06:43 PM            

The end of the handle was made from at least 6 parts, soldered together: four leaves, the cattail, and the round piece. The bowl was shaped somehow, whether cast or raised or stamped or what, and excess metal was cut off around it to form the elaborately shaped back edge. The part of the handle you're calling the "bar" was pointed and curved at the end to fit against the bowl, then soldered into a slot in the flat part of the bowl the bowl at that end, and to the cattail assemblage at the other. (Your picture of the handle end of the bowl includes a piece that's actually part of the handle, and it fills in the slot where the handle is soldered in.) The matte texture was applied to the bowl. The whole thing was plated with silver, and then the bowl was gilded.

If you gentlemen promise to send them back before the summer is over (because we NEED them here for eating ICE CREAM), I can send one to you and one to agleopar to inspect in person. Or I could send two to agleopar, so he can compare them and see that they are not identical enough to be cast from a single mold.

I may be wrong about how the bowl was made--I don't really know what combination of raising, casting, repousseeing, jigsawing, and soldering on other elements was involved--but I'm 100% sure the cattail end was made by soldering together separate cast pieces.

posted 10-06-2017 12:47 AM            

quote:

---

Philadelphia Museum of Art

• Ice Cream Serving Spoon

• George B. Sharp, American (active Philadelphia), 1819 - 1904

• Geography: Made in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, United States, North and Central America

• Date: 1866-1870

• Medium: Silver

• Dimensions: 10 7/8 x 2 13/16 inches (27.6 x 7.1 cm) Weight: 4 ounces 2 dwt

• Curatorial Department: American Art

• Object Location: Currently not on view

• Accession Number: 2002-206-14

• Credit Line: 125th Anniversary Acquisition. Gift of John Whitenight and Frederick LaValley, 2002

---

posted 11-01-2017 11:27 AM            

"A Very Unique Spoon by George Sharp Philadelphia, PA 1844-1900
5 1/2 inches long
A very Unique Pattern, It is marked and we are not 100 % that its by Sharp, and we don't see a sterling mark
Weight .76 ozt,
Condition - very light surface wear"

They did not show a photo of the mark.

I'm hoping the auction winner is a member of this board and will post about the spoon--especially photos of the mark--or will at least email Scott about the spoon, if he/she doesn't like posting publicly. How I wish I could examine it in person!

posted 11-01-2017 12:30 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Polly:
...Scott, now that the auction is over, would it be okay to link to it or to extract photos from the listing? The seller took good photos (of everything but the mark).

---

Posting the photo will ensure they remain visible ... don't link.

posted 11-02-2017 09:27 AM            

In the above:

• Use only http:// The s should not be used.
  
• The [\img] is the wrong image tag, it should be [/img]

Between the image tags [img] [/img] the URL http://www.smpub.com/ubb/images/17/21-1442-eb-cattail.jpg should be used.

We have to reverse engineer the legacy forum Perl/CGI code to eliminate the http: https: issue. Until we get around to doing this please make sure your image URL's don't use https:

posted 11-06-2017 10:15 PM            

The shop is not too far from NYC (Summit Antiques Center in NJ). However it was very cheap so perhaps worth it just for its scholarly value.

posted 11-07-2017 12:06 PM            

Paul, if you find yourself in that antiques mall again and the mustard ladle is still there, would you take a few photos for me? Many thanks!