SMP Logo
SM Publications
Silver Salon Forums - The premier site for discussing Silver.
SMP | Silver Salon Forums | SSF - Guidelines | SSF - FAQ | Silver Sales


Welcome to the Silver Salon Forums !
Since 1993
Over 11,793 threads & 64,769 posts !!

New members' post here Forum

The Silver Salon Forums are open to anyone with an interest in silver and a willingness to share. Know little or nothing about silver? Don't worry! Anyone with a genuine desire to explore the subject of silver and related metal crafts is welcome.



Favorites: (9/09/07) 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11


REGISTER (click here) How to Post Photos


customtitle open  SMP Silver Salon Forums
tlineopen  New members post here
tline3open  Proof that dates can't be believed

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search

ForumFriend SSFFriend: Email This Page to Someone! next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   Proof that dates can't be believed
jag

Posts: 24
Registered: Jun 2011

iconnumber posted 06-17-2011 01:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for jag     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I only have one spoon that has a date engraved on it, so I figured I at least knew when that one was made. But strangely enough this is also the spoon that I can pin down the manufacture date more accurately than any of my others (thanks to Wev's reference materials). And the date doesn't match the manufacture date.

Here's the spoon:

And although its clearly dated 1808, the Cary Boynton & Woodward partnership only lasted from 1835 to 1837. So clearly the engraving must have been commemorating some past event. (And I just noticed that this is another example of a silversmith purposely mis-spelling his own name - Cary is really Isaac Carey, 1802-1867)

IP: Logged

wev
Moderator

Posts: 4121
Registered: Apr 99

iconnumber posted 06-17-2011 11:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for wev     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A silver anniversary, two years late? I've done that.

As a note, I lately tracked down Philip Rose Woodford of the partnership -- he was born 30 September 1806 in Westbrook ME and was the 2nd great, great grandson of Paul's dad, Apollos Rivoire

IP: Logged

bascall

Posts: 1629
Registered: Nov 99

iconnumber posted 06-17-2011 09:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for bascall     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
There is a Philip R Woodford in Maine Death Records who died in Deering, Maine on 21 August 1880. Philip R Woodford is listed in census's and directories for Boston up to 1880 and not after that year. There are several Woodfords in Deering in 1880 and one of them, William who was born about 1806, was a comb maker like Philip.

[This message has been edited by bascall (edited 06-17-2011).]

IP: Logged

jag

Posts: 24
Registered: Jun 2011

iconnumber posted 06-20-2011 05:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jag     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Oh THAT Paul! I didn't know who you meant until I clicked the link. I guess a silverworker can't get much better lineage than that.

IP: Logged

Kimo

Posts: 1627
Registered: Mar 2003

iconnumber posted 06-21-2011 05:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kimo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Dates engraved on silver seem to rarely reflect the date the piece of silver was actually made. More often they commemorate a date in the past, or they are applied to a piece of silver anywhere from one year after it was made to a great many years afterward since silver tends to get repurposed rather than discarded as the years go along. As such they are of limited use in trying to determine when a piece of silver was made.

IP: Logged

Ulysses Dietz
Moderator

Posts: 1265
Registered: May 99

iconnumber posted 06-29-2011 10:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ulysses Dietz     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The great fallacy of engraved dates! And yet they're always useful for some reason...I have a fork with my great-great-grandmother's name engraved on it. Someone later on (maybe her daughter in law in 1900?) carefully had the year of her marriage engraved under her name...and thus the date is probably accurate, but not original to the piece. But useful in terms of its history. Likewise, here at the Museum, we have a great tea and coffee service by Fletcher & Gardiner, with the monogram of the original couple for whom it was made. But a later inscription with an 1804 date on it ascribes it as a wedding gift...long before the partnership of F&G existed. So I'm figuring maybe a 10th anniversary gift...or just a purchase once the couple got settled (or inherited some major cash, since it's a massive set). I love it when dates mesh exactly with other dating clues (like my 1865 dated Gorham Medallion table spoon--because the pattern was new when my great-great-grandmother bought the flatware). But dates are always a fun part of the puzzle.

IP: Logged

All times are ET

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:


Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.46a


1. Public Silver Forums (open Free membership) - anyone with a valid e-mail address may register. Once you have received your Silver Salon Forum password, and then if you abide by the Silver Salon Forum Guidelines, you may start a thread or post a reply in the New Members' Forum. New Members who show a continued willingness to participate, to completely read and abide by the Guidelines will be allowed to post to the Member Public Forums.
Click here to Register for a Free password

2. Private Silver Salon Forums (invitational or $ donation membership) - The Private Silver Salon Forums require registration and special authorization to view, search, start a thread or to post a reply. Special authorization can be obtained in one of several ways: by Invitation; Annual $ Donation; or via Special Limited Membership. For more details click here (under development).

3. Administrative/Special Private Forums (special membership required) - These forums are reserved for special subjects or administrative discussion. These forums are not open to the public and require special authorization to view or post.


| Home | Order | The Guide to Evaluating Gold & Silver Objects | The Book of Silver
| Update BOS Registration | Silver Library | For Sale | Our Wants List | Silver Dealers | Speakers Bureau |
| Silversmiths | How to set a table | Shows | SMP | Silver News |
copyright © 1993 - 2022 SM Publications
All Rights Reserved.
Legal & Privacy Notices