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thunderswamp

Posts: 3
Registered: Mar 2017

iconnumber posted 03-05-2017 01:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for thunderswamp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hello -

I am a new member. Let me introduce myself. My name is Marianne and I have been a silver spoon and silverplate flatware amateur collector on and off for about 20 years; solely for my personal pleasure - not as a business. My particular interest is in early American patterns through the 1940's. In addition to the history I love the multitude of patterns to suit every taste, the feel of flatware in the hand and the patina and sheen of silver.

I very much enjoyed reading the post (from 1999) on the Kings pattern questioning the earliest origins in the US. I have a set of 5 single strike Kings pattern forks with unusual stamps and engravings which I am posting images of on that thread. It seems the most appropriate place to continue the conversation (if it will allow me to reply at this late date).

Looking forward to learning more and keeping up on the posts.

Thank you for the opportunity.

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Kimo

Posts: 1627
Registered: Mar 2003

iconnumber posted 03-05-2017 11:20 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kimo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Marianne - welcome to the Forum! It is so nice to have a person with your interests in silver and silver plate become a member and I very much look forward to seeing your participation.

I know that I and everyone else will enjoy seeing some pieces of your silver. Follow the directions in the Guidelines on how to post photos step by step and you should have no difficulties posting photos, but if you do please just ask help.

Kimo
Contributing Editor, SSF

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Scott Martin
Forum Master

Posts: 11520
Registered: Apr 93

iconnumber posted 03-05-2017 12:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Scott Martin     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hello and welcome.

Until you have all access privileges, please post your images in this forum. The moderators will add the images and any comments to the tread you mention when posting the images.

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thunderswamp

Posts: 3
Registered: Mar 2017

iconnumber posted 03-05-2017 11:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for thunderswamp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you. I have updated post with links to images below.

Description:
I have 5 forks of unknown origin in a single stamp Kings pattern.
The shell pattern on the front is concaved; there is no shell design to posterior surface of handle terminal.

I am guessing these are silverplate each weighing approx 50 grams - each fork is inscribed on the heel with different initials in script all ending with McL (McLaughlin?) and followed with "78" - 1778? 1878?

On one fork there is a second set of initials ending McL with '42 (1842?) above the "78" initial - In a different hand but same script style

At backside of the Shell form as shown in the photos is a stippled Old English Style font - Morris 1840 - same on all 5 forks.

On the back of the stem where you might expect to find the name of the maker there are individual letter stamps - reminiscent of English hallmarks - spelling out KERREY.

Hopefully the photos will answer any questions. I am curious about any information on the KERREY stamps and Morris 1840. We can only guess I suppose on the personalized monograms.

Has anyone seen markings like this before?

LINK TO IMAGES:

Thank you,

[This message has been edited by thunderswamp (edited 04-21-2017).]

[This message has been edited by thunderswamp (edited 04-21-2017).]

[This message has been edited by thunderswamp (edited 04-21-2017).]

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Scott Martin
Forum Master

Posts: 11520
Registered: Apr 93

iconnumber posted 04-22-2017 10:24 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Scott Martin     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for the properly posted images.

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Kimo

Posts: 1627
Registered: Mar 2003

iconnumber posted 04-23-2017 12:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kimo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It is hard to say and I am not an expert on these, but my first thought is that they were likely a part of a set purchased in 1840 by a family named Morris. Then a daughter in this family married a man with the last name that started with the initial McL and they had children. In 1872 this set was given to the daughter for some event such as an anniversary or perhaps the passing of her mother or? and at that time the McL and '72 and first name initial of each family member was engraved. Then in 1942 a descendant of this family had the year "42 engraved to make this one plus possibly other pieces of the set theirs to follow the family tradition on this flatware? This is just guessing of course but it is what makes the most sense to me at this point and until someone can be more positive about the dates of the markings.

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asheland

Posts: 935
Registered: Nov 2003

iconnumber posted 04-24-2017 11:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for asheland     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Welcome to the forum. smile

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thunderswamp

Posts: 3
Registered: Mar 2017

iconnumber posted 05-23-2017 08:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for thunderswamp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Kimo:
It is hard to say and I am not an expert on these, but my first thought is that they were likely a part of a set purchased in 1840 by a family named Morris. Then a daughter in this family married a man with the last name that started with the initial McL and they had children. In 1872 this set was given to the daughter for some event such as an anniversary or perhaps the passing of her mother or? and at that time the McL and '72 and first name initial of each family member was engraved. Then in 1942 a descendant of this family had the year "42 engraved to make this one plus possibly other pieces of the set theirs to follow the family tradition on this flatware? This is just guessing of course but it is what makes the most sense to me at this point and until someone can be more positive about the dates of the markings.

Thank you. I agree there is an interesting family connection somewhere in there. I am also interested in the Maker. Is there any history on hallmarks in original American made (presuming these are American) silver? They are clearly stamped but I cant find anything similar in characters or style to link them to a silversmith.

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ahwt

Posts: 2334
Registered: Mar 2003

iconnumber posted 05-24-2017 03:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ahwt     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Your spoons are very interesting, but I do not know who KERRY is. At first glance I thought these gothic letter marks were typical of what one found on English silver plated items.
However that they spell out a name makes them more typical of an identification of a U.S. manufacturer or retailer; although the use of gothic letter is unusual for U.S. companies.
I don't think the squared off shoulder is that common and when used I think it is usually before 1850.
The Kings pattern and its many variations are among my favorite patterns and I would just enjoy the mystery of all the markings on your forks.

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Kimo

Posts: 1627
Registered: Mar 2003

iconnumber posted 06-16-2017 09:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kimo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I hope someone will be able to explain the KERREY marking, but my initial guess is that it may be more likely to be the retailer than the maker as I am unaware of any silversmiths named Kerrey.

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Scott Martin
Forum Master

Posts: 11520
Registered: Apr 93

iconnumber posted 06-16-2017 03:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Scott Martin     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Perhaps not but I did find:

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