SMP Logo
SM Publications
Silver Salon Forums - The premier site for discussing Silver.
SMP | Silver Salon Forums | SSF - Guidelines | SSF - FAQ | Silver Sales


Welcome to the Silver Salon Forums !
Since 1993
Over 11,793 threads & 64,769 posts !!

New members' post here Forum

The Silver Salon Forums are open to anyone with an interest in silver and a willingness to share. Know little or nothing about silver? Don't worry! Anyone with a genuine desire to explore the subject of silver and related metal crafts is welcome.



Favorites: (9/09/07) 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11


REGISTER (click here) How to Post Photos


customtitle open  SMP Silver Salon Forums
tlineopen  New members post here
tline3open  Spoon I.D.

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
profile | register | preferences | faq | search

ForumFriend SSFFriend: Email This Page to Someone! next newest topic | next oldest topic
Author Topic:   Spoon I.D.
Rust9

Posts: 4
Registered: Dec 2018

iconnumber posted 12-12-2018 07:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rust9     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I think this is a Whiting Hyperion spoon, though I can not find the exact spoon anywhere. Also, the mark looks German? Any thoughts or help would be much appreciated....

[This message has been edited by Rust9 (edited 12-12-2018).]

IP: Logged

Rust9

Posts: 4
Registered: Dec 2018

iconnumber posted 12-12-2018 07:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rust9     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

And, my name is Rusty, I currently live in Central Oregon. This is one of 3 random pieces that came with an inherited set of silver. Having fun doing some research, Thanks!

IP: Logged

Hose_dk

Posts: 400
Registered: May 2008

iconnumber posted 12-14-2018 01:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Hose_dk     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
you are most likely right that its German.
Thats all i can supply.

IP: Logged

Rust9

Posts: 4
Registered: Dec 2018

iconnumber posted 12-14-2018 05:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rust9     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for the reply. I am a bit confused because from what I have found Whiting was an American company so not sure why it would have a German mark.?.

IP: Logged

Kimo

Posts: 1627
Registered: Mar 2003

iconnumber posted 12-14-2018 09:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kimo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Why do you think it is Whiting? I agree that it is very likely a German maker rather than an American maker like Whiting. My reasons are the crescent moon mark and the fact that it is made of relatively low grade silver alloy with 800 parts per thousand which was relatively standard at the time for silver objects made in Germany. Whiting would have used Sterling silver which is 925 parts per thousand silver.

IP: Logged

ahwt

Posts: 2334
Registered: Mar 2003

iconnumber posted 12-14-2018 10:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ahwt     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It looks like an American company and a German company shared the same design. Maybe they just crossed licensed each other for the design or had some other arrangement. As Kimo noted the difference in silver content means they were making the silver in their own country and not just retailing someone else’s silver.
Interesting mystery.

IP: Logged

Rust9

Posts: 4
Registered: Dec 2018

iconnumber posted 12-14-2018 10:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rust9     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for the feedback. I was sure it was Whiting Hyperion because of the really close similarity in design.

But, I did not quite understand why it would have a German mark......

IP: Logged

June Martin
Forum Master

Posts: 1326
Registered: Apr 93

iconnumber posted 12-15-2018 07:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for June Martin     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Sure does look like Hyperion. Could have been a licensing arrangement but then again there is always plagiarism.

IP: Logged

Kimo

Posts: 1627
Registered: Mar 2003

iconnumber posted 12-17-2018 04:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kimo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Copying popular designs seems not to have been entirely uncommon during that era. Especially when one company made tiny and not easily seen modifications so that they could say their design was not an exact reproduction of that of another company, especially when the companies were in different countries. Another example when a popular design was being made by three different companies in three different countries is Peau de Lion. This was made by Christofle in France, Fraget in Warsaw, and Gorham in the US. Each put their own marks on the items they made.

IP: Logged

ahwt

Posts: 2334
Registered: Mar 2003

iconnumber posted 12-18-2018 01:17 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for ahwt     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
There were international agreements when this pattern was designed that may have allowed Whiting to secure rights in Germany, but securing rights in other countries has always been expensive and foreign countries tend to have laws that favor natives. Whiting may well have decided not to obtain rights or do business in Germany or any other country.
Gorham was one company that did conduct business in foreign countries. They sold and manufactured in England starting in the early 1900s. Gorham in England ( Gorham Birmingham UK - teaspoon) is an interesting post on this company.

The United States conducted business with foreign countries much as they did with us. For most of the 1800s our publishers routinely and blatantly published the best foreign works without permission or payment to the authors. This worked out good for our publishers, but not so good for our authors. Royalty free works from Europe tended to keep the price our authors could get low.

IP: Logged

Polly

Posts: 1970
Registered: Nov 2004

iconnumber posted 12-18-2018 05:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Polly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I believe Dickens was particularly peeved by American piracy.

IP: Logged

Kimo

Posts: 1627
Registered: Mar 2003

iconnumber posted 12-18-2018 09:59 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kimo     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
When I look really closely at the Whiting Hyperion photo above and the photo of the spoon in the original posting I see some small differences, as if they were made from different dies that were carved to be almost the same but not quite. For example, if you count the number of beads around the central oval that can be used for engraving initials, the Whiting seems to have more beads than the unknown German made one.

IP: Logged

June Martin
Forum Master

Posts: 1326
Registered: Apr 93

iconnumber posted 12-22-2018 03:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for June Martin     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The devil is in the details. We've spent many hours over the years scrutinizing small nuances of patterns to delineate one from the other.

IP: Logged

All times are ET

next newest topic | next oldest topic

Administrative Options: Close Topic | Archive/Move | Delete Topic
Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:


Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.46a


1. Public Silver Forums (open Free membership) - anyone with a valid e-mail address may register. Once you have received your Silver Salon Forum password, and then if you abide by the Silver Salon Forum Guidelines, you may start a thread or post a reply in the New Members' Forum. New Members who show a continued willingness to participate, to completely read and abide by the Guidelines will be allowed to post to the Member Public Forums.
Click here to Register for a Free password

2. Private Silver Salon Forums (invitational or $ donation membership) - The Private Silver Salon Forums require registration and special authorization to view, search, start a thread or to post a reply. Special authorization can be obtained in one of several ways: by Invitation; Annual $ Donation; or via Special Limited Membership. For more details click here (under development).

3. Administrative/Special Private Forums (special membership required) - These forums are reserved for special subjects or administrative discussion. These forums are not open to the public and require special authorization to view or post.


| Home | Order | The Guide to Evaluating Gold & Silver Objects | The Book of Silver
| Update BOS Registration | Silver Library | For Sale | Our Wants List | Silver Dealers | Speakers Bureau |
| Silversmiths | How to set a table | Shows | SMP | Silver News |
copyright © 1993 - 2022 SM Publications
All Rights Reserved.
Legal & Privacy Notices