Ravinet d'Enfert Odd shaped spoon - SMP Silver Salon Forums

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Ravinet d'Enfert Odd shaped spoon

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Author	Topic: Ravinet d'Enfert Odd shaped spoon
JinOregon Posts: 13 Registered: Nov 2024	posted 03-05-2025 02:43 PM Hello! I recently picked up this beautiful engraved piece. I can’t find out much about it other than the maker. It is marked but it’s very hard to see even with a 16x loupe. It appears to be hand engraved as well. Does anyone have any information about this piece? Thanks! IP: Logged
JinOregon Posts: 13 Registered: Nov 2024	posted 03-18-2025 06:24 PM Nobody knows anything about this?? Is it that unusual??? IP: Logged
June Martin Forum Master Posts: 1370 Registered: Apr 93	posted 03-18-2025 06:36 PM You said you were able to find the maker. Would you like to share who that is? What type of information are you looking for? This is not necessarily a forum where you are going to get instantaneous answers. IP: Logged
JinOregon Posts: 13 Registered: Nov 2024	posted 03-21-2025 11:07 AM quote: Originally posted by June Martin: You said you were able to find the maker. Would you like to share who that is? What type of information are you looking for? This is not necessarily a forum where you are going to get instantaneous answers. Hello, the maker is in the title “Ravinet d'Enfert”. I am curious about the shape, is it a jelly spoon or something else? I’m curious about the engraving, I can’t seem to find anything like it online. Could this possibly be sterling even though it’s not marked? I only ask because it’s engraved and I wouldn’t think it would be engravable if it were plated. Really any information about it would be appreciated. Thanks! IP: Logged
Scott Martin Forum Master Posts: 11593 Registered: Apr 93	posted 03-21-2025 11:37 AM quote: Could this possibly be sterling even though it’s not marked? No. French solid silver must be marked. IP: Logged
Scott Martin Forum Master Posts: 11593 Registered: Apr 93	posted 03-21-2025 12:03 PM There is a simply test that has been helpful over the years. The *"Flex Test"* Put your hands on a similarly sized and shaped piece of flatware which you know is Sterling (not silverplate). And also on a similarly sized and shaped piece of flatware which you know is silverplate. Gently compare the flexibility of the sterling versus the silverplate. Silverplate is typically stiff and the sterling tends to have a springiness. It is good to get familiar with doing the test with many different similarly sized items. Please note: when you get to very low grade solid silver (often found in the "third world") items made with low grade solid silver can feel stiff. [This message has been edited by Scott Martin (edited 03-22-2025).] IP: Logged
RichardT Posts: 18 Registered: Mar 2007	posted 03-21-2025 08:02 PM If this were 19th century American, I'd call this a jelly spoon or certainly some sort of serving spoon. But the French have a flattened dessert spoon which can be called a "French sauce spoon" or (per Wikipedia) a cuillère à sauce individuelle, for use in scraping the chocolate sauce or creme Anglaise off your dessert plate. IP: Logged
JinOregon Posts: 13 Registered: Nov 2024	posted 03-22-2025 01:35 AM Thank you all for the information. Fascinating how many different silverware items there are. IP: Logged
Scott Martin Forum Master Posts: 11593 Registered: Apr 93	posted 04-03-2025 04:13 PM The basics sell themselves. Invention & marketing sells the rest. IP: Logged
JinOregon Posts: 13 Registered: Nov 2024	posted 05-02-2025 11:21 PM quote: Originally posted by Scott Martin: There is a simply test that has been helpful over the years. The *"Flex Test"* Put your hands on a similarly sized and shaped piece of flatware which you know is Sterling (not silverplate). And also on a similarly sized and shaped piece of flatware which you know is silverplate. Gently compare the flexibility of the sterling versus the silverplate. Silverplate is typically stiff and the sterling tends to have a springiness. It is good to get familiar with doing the test with many different similarly sized items. Please note: when you get to very low grade solid silver (often found in the "third world") items made with low grade solid silver can feel stiff. (Update) I tried the flex test. It’s pretty soft, bent very easily. I also found that this pattern is called “Empire”. I still have not been able to find an exact match. The only pieces that are similarly engraved are silver. It seems to me that a plated piece would NOT be engraved. The engraving would penetrate the plating. If it were plated post engraving it would have filled the engraving and look softer not as sharp. It’s soooooo frustrating that I can’t find one like this anywhere online. [This message has been edited by Mod assistant (edited 05-03-2025).] IP: Logged
ahwt Posts: 2404 Registered: Mar 2003	posted 05-05-2025 03:08 PM One thing you might try is a saved search on eBay for “Ravinet d'Enfert”. Sooner or later you may get lucky and see a spoon like you have. Google at one time had this service although I do not know if they still offer it. The last time I used Google for this it was called Google Alerts. I have a friend in the silver plating business and normally machine engraving is used for silver plated items. Hand engraving is better for sterling as the engraving is deeper. On some Old Sheffield Plate pieces a block of sterling was inserted into the piece where the engraved was placed. [This message has been edited by ahwt (edited 05-05-2025).] IP: Logged
June Martin Forum Master Posts: 1370 Registered: Apr 93	posted 05-06-2025 07:33 AM To ahwt's point, I've seen some beautifully engraved silverplate pieces. IP: Logged
Kimo Posts: 1660 Registered: Mar 2003	posted 05-06-2025 10:22 AM I agree that engraving is done to both solid and plated silverware so the presence of engraving is not a useful way for determining solid vs. plated. Most plated silverware, especially older things, tend to have several layers of silverplating meaning that engraving does not cut through. The most effective way too tell if it is solid silver is whether it is so marked since all makers were quick to mark their products to help with sales and higher prices along with many countries having a legal requirement for doing so. Absence of a silver mark means this is 99 percent likely to be silver plate. If you really believe this could be "unmarked solid silver" the definitive way to tell is to find a jeweler or precious metals dealer who has invested in buying an XRF gun who is willing to test it. X-Ray Fluorescence guns are shaped like a handgun except they use x-rays and a built-in computer that will penetrate all the way through a metal object and tell you exactly what elements are present in their exact percentages. A new one will cost between $20,000 and $40,000 and a used one can be as little as $10,000 to $15,000. Because of this cost, normally the only people who invest in buying one are dealers and stores that need to know what metals they are buying and selling. Inexpensive acid tests, scratch plate tests, taste tests, smell tests, feel tests, etc. are not very accurate and tend to tell you very roughly what the surface metal is but not what is below the surface. My suggestion is to enjoy having and using a beautiful spoon that is most likely silverplated. [This message has been edited by Kimo (edited 05-06-2025).] IP: Logged

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