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In this Forum we discuss the silver of the United Kingdom, as well as British Colonial silver and Old Sheffield Plate. Past British - Irish Sterling topics/threads worth a look. |
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In this Forum we discuss the silver of the United Kingdom, as well as British Colonial silver and Old Sheffield Plate. Past British - Irish Sterling topics/threads worth a look. |
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 SMP Silver Salon Forums
 British / Irish Sterling
 19th C Canadian?
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| Author | Topic: 19th C Canadian? |
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Eddie E unregistered |
posted 02-19-2004 10:07 PM
 
Hello: I was hoping that someone might be able to assist in identifying the maker of a fiddle pattern tablespoon 8.75" in length (good weight) which I suspect to be 19th C Canadian. There are 4 individual punch marks each containing a letter. The letters are as follows: Reading from left to right they are Y,S,&,Co. There are no pseudomarks just the 4 letters. It doesn't have the look or feel of plate. Monogram is done vertically not horizontally. Any ideas or insight would be appreciated. Eddie E IP: Logged |
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swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 |
posted 02-22-2004 01:00 PM
A phptograph of both the piece and the mark would be a great help in arriving at an identification, if you could provide one. Generally speaking, however, if the letters are in individual reserves, these then would most likely be marks of an English plater. John Yates and his sons were prolific makers and exporters of electroplated wares in Birmingham, and their firm went through a number of changes of name and marks. Since nobody else has provided a positive identification, I would guess that it might be something like "Yates, Sons, & Co.", although it is not shown as such among the 20 or so marks of the firm listed in my source. IP: Logged |
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Eddie E unregistered |
posted 02-22-2004 08:16 PM
Wish I could provide a picture of the spoon and marks however I don't have a camera that will do the job. Thanks for the feedback on a possible English connection. According to Unitt's Book of Marks, there was a Y.S. & C0 working in New Brunswick, Canada in c. 1815 (Y.S.& Co was contained in one mark, not 4 individual marks) however there is no further information. Anyone with additional books on Canadian silversmiths that might shed light on this particular maker? Thanks again, Eddie IP: Logged |
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swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 |
posted 02-22-2004 10:25 PM
The Unitt's mark is taken from a table fork with no provenance given - while it may have been found locally, it could have come from anywhere. There is no mention of such a company working in New Brunswick in either Unitt or Langdon, nor does MacKay even mention it in his monograph on the Atlantic Provinces. The 1815 date is probably a guess based on the style of the fork. What is the style of your spoon? IP: Logged |
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Eddie E unregistered |
posted 02-22-2004 11:41 PM
The tablespoon is 8.75" length in the fiddle pattern (fiddle end is 2.5" length before narrowing to stem). Style doesn't look English to me but 19th Century American coin silver type. Marks are at the top end, bowl comes to a distinctive point and not a lightweight spoon. Monogram read vertically. Hope that helps. Interesting points made regarding the New Brunswick attribution. Eddie IP: Logged |
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swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 |
posted 02-23-2004 06:54 PM
American coin silver spoons are often quite light. Some are more substantial than others, but none can really be described as heavy. If by "the monogram reads vertically," you mean the letters are one above the other with the handle pointing upwards, this arrangement is not typical of the period; it is sometimes seen on later spoons. What is the style of lettering? There are some pictures of a variety of examples of 19th C American spoon styles near the end of the thread entitled Fiddle pattern development. Perhaps you can match your spoon to one of these. IP: Logged |
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Eddie E unregistered |
posted 02-23-2004 08:50 PM
I have had a look at the examples you suggested regarding fiddle pattern development. The posting for 5.25.2003 at 2:30 pm (second set of pictures, third horizontal fiddle pattern spoon from the top)is a perfect example of the one in my possession. The monogram is the same style and done the same way. Sorry, it was misleading to say the monogram was done vertically. What time period does this style of spoon date to? IP: Logged |
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swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 |
posted 02-24-2004 11:17 AM
That particular spoon dates approximately 1830 - 50, give or take a few years. Stylistic variations in American spoons are often fairly subtle, and there are many more than those illustrated. This point undrescores the value of a picture, however poor it may be. Lacking a suitable still camera, even a camcorder can take an acceptable image if it focuses close up, as most do, and if it can take a still image (or if one's computer has the ability to capture a single frame). IP: Logged |
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