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posted 02-09-2005 07:44 PM            

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I have acquired a marrow scoop, Britannia standard, dated London 1722. The maker's mark is HA with a + above and between the letters. Might someone be able to help me identify the maker?

Many thanks.

[This message has been edited by Hughes226 (edited 02-11-2005).]

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posted 02-10-2005 02:14 AM            

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I can't find a mark of this exact description listed in Jacksons, but there are a couple of close-ish matches. A picture would be a great help.

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posted 02-10-2005 09:47 AM            

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This is the first time I have tried posting an image on a BB. Here goes:

Does this help?

T.

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posted 02-10-2005 12:04 PM            

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This maker does not appear in any of the standard London references (Grimwade, Jackson, Kent, Fallon). I cannot make out a city mark (only the Britannia and Lion's Head Erased)- are you sure it is London? Maybe Chester 1707 (no such maker's mark in Ridgway, though)?

[This message has been edited by swarter (edited 02-10-2005).]

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posted 02-10-2005 12:11 PM            

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Many thanks for checking your sources for the maker's mark. I think the marks are (from left to right in photo):

Pre-duty mark lion in profile
London 1722 date mark
Britannia mark
Unknown maker's mark

I'm not sure that any of these is Chester.

T.

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posted 02-10-2005 12:30 PM            

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Maybe Charles HAtfield, London 1727? There are three different marks from him...
Sazikov2000

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posted 02-10-2005 02:11 PM            

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I wonder if the date (1722) is too late for Harache II?

T.

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posted 02-11-2005 06:39 AM            

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This is the TOP of the maker's mark of:
PAUL HANET of London
A Huguenot specialist spoonmaker
(marrow scoops count as spoons!)

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posted 02-11-2005 09:05 AM            

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Silver Lyon,

This is very interesting indeed. Might it be possible for you to post an image of the Paul Hanet mark?

[This message has been edited by Hughes226 (edited 02-11-2005).]

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posted 02-11-2005 01:05 PM            

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I will see what I can do - but it won't be tomorrow - I need to find a piece with a good enough full mark to show well - With any luck one of the many (cleverer) members of the forum will get there first!!

[This message has been edited by Silver Lyon (edited 02-11-2005).]

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posted 02-11-2005 01:06 PM            

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Grimwade shows this mark with a pellet rather than the cross, and notes "poor impression." Fallon, however, does show the cross, but my early morning vision was too blurry to see it in the index table of marks - Having looked at Grimwade's Hanay mark more carefully first, I was careless in looking only for someone else. Never rely exclusively on drawn marks, no matter how reliable the source, especially when they are small, as they are in Grimwade. Here is the larger image from the text section in Fallon(again a drawn mark, but clear):

A photograph of the actual mark would still be helpful for confirmation.

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posted 02-11-2005 01:10 PM            

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Swarter,

Unfortunately, the image of the mark is not showing up on my browser. (Only a box with an x in it.) Do I need to adjust my browser settings in order to view the image?

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posted 02-11-2005 01:11 PM            

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I can see it now! Thanks very much.

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posted 02-11-2005 01:13 PM            

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See!! - and SO FAST!!
Just to avoid confusion - he was 'Free of the Long-Bow Makers' because he was able to 'BUY' his freedom (this is called Freedom by Redemption) and thus gain a legal right to practice his trade within the confines of the jurisdiction of the City of London.
As a Huguenot he would not have been able to do this (become Free by Redemption) at this point in time through the Worshipful Company of Goldsmiths.

[This message has been edited by Silver Lyon (edited 02-11-2005).]

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posted 02-11-2005 01:22 PM            

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This is almost certainly the correct mark. The top of the star beneath the HA is visible on the scoop.

I assume that his mark would have changed to PH at some point. Was this convention not adopted as of 1720? If so, given that my scoop has a date mark of 1722, I wonder why the mark is not PH?

The scoop was sold to me on the basis that it was Harache II, but I began to question this after the purchase when the date didn't match-up with the maker. This was my first purchase of Georgian silver. I will be more careful next time. (Although both are Huguenot makers from the same period, so I suppose there has been no harm done?)

Thank you again for all of your help. I can see how silver could quickly become an addiction for me. It is fascinating.

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posted 02-11-2005 01:32 PM            

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The mark is a New Standard (Britannia) mark, showing the first two letters of the last name, instead of the initials, as in the Old Standard (Sterling). New Standard marks appear with the Lion's Head Erased and Britannia marks. Old Standard marks were restored on reinstitution of the Old Standard, so those marks always appear with the Lion's Head Crowned and Lion Passant, and with the later Leopard's Head (actually a maneless lion).

[This message has been edited by swarter (edited 02-11-2005).]

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