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Author	Topic: Unknown Maker
Waylander Posts: 131 Registered: Sep 2004	posted 06-12-2005 06:10 PM Hello all Just yesterday I picked up a pair of tongs from an Antiques Fair in Sydney. While I didn't expect to be buying anything (and thus had no references with me), the tongs has unusual square shaped (angular) tips, and a male Duty Mark dating them pre 1840. They were a bit of a bargain, so I snapped them up as a bit of a gamble. Details? No Town mark. Maker's mark is W.W and the seller was convinced that they were by William Welch (Jr), Exeter. I've looked at the other marks, and suspect they will date to 1813. As for the maker - well, I've looked at Welch's mark, but it doesn't seem to have the "full stop" that my mark has between the W's. The closest I'm come is W.Wrangham, Sheffield, Jackson's 3rd edition, page 444, but even then I am not totally satisfied. In any case, I throw it open to the floor for comments, advice and help. I have posted photos (hopefully!) of the maker's mark, the other hallmarks and one of the tongs themselves. Cheers Waylander IP: Logged
IJP Posts: 326 Registered: Oct 2004	posted 06-13-2005 06:23 PM The absence of a town mark is a good indication that what you have is not English sterling. As I understand it, English marking regulations are especially strict, and in no case would an item turn up marked in any way other than the regulations demand. With that in mind, what I think is likely is that these sugar tongs are American coin silver, with pseudohallmarks typical of such silver during the 19th century. The newly published Manufacturer's Marks on American Coin Silver (McGrew) does not appear to include such pseudohallmarks as you have shown. Kovel's American Silver Marks has several "WW" marks that may be worth looking into, but I can't say if any of these are the maker of your item. If this is indeed coin silver, you should also consider that the "WW" may be the mark of a retailer, rather than the maker, and that the maker may only be indicated by the Profile-Lion-R. But all this is just conjecture. IP: Logged
swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 Registered: May 2003	posted 06-13-2005 07:32 PM Small English items were not required to be completely marked in this perios. See Sugar tongs with only Lion Passant and Makers mark and several others for discussions of this practice. IP: Logged
PhilO Posts: 166 Registered: Jul 2004	posted 06-14-2005 02:00 AM I agree with Waylander that this mark is almost certainly Exeter, 1813. As he points out William Welch's mark is normally shown without a stop between the Ws. I have seen the W.W form on Exeter silver attributed variously to William Welch and William Woodman. Jackson only mentions these 2 silversmiths with the initials WW during the 1st quarter of the 19th century, but Woodman's first mention in the records is noted as 1818 so I think he can be ruled out. Welch is first mentioned in 1801, so I suspect that this is a variant of his mark. Phil IP: Logged
Waylander Posts: 131 Registered: Sep 2004	posted 06-14-2005 06:09 AM Thanks to all, especially Phil. I was half suspecting it may be a variant Exeter mark (by Welch or Woodman), so some agreement with that "theory" is appreciated. Cheers Waylander IP: Logged
ahwt Posts: 2377 Registered: Mar 2003	posted 06-14-2005 10:04 AM The thread that Swarter pointed out is very helpful. A popular internet auction site often has small English items with only the Lion Passant mark and the initials of the maker listed under coin silver. The seller often identifies the Lion Passant as a �pseudo mark� used by American silversmiths. The English took great care in stamping silver objects and normally their marks seem to have been applied is such a way has to be clearer and more distinct than many of the marks found on American silver. IP: Logged
IJP Posts: 326 Registered: Oct 2004	posted 06-14-2005 11:25 AM You learn something new every day! It appears that in order to know about all of the exceptions and abberrations, one really must become a specialist. You know what they say about a jack of all trades... IP: Logged

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