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In this Forum we discuss the silver of the United Kingdom, as well as British Colonial silver and Old Sheffield Plate. Past British - Irish Sterling topics/threads worth a look. |
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In this Forum we discuss the silver of the United Kingdom, as well as British Colonial silver and Old Sheffield Plate. Past British - Irish Sterling topics/threads worth a look. |
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| How to Post Photos | Want to be a Moderator? |
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 SMP Silver Salon Forums
 British / Irish Sterling
 A fun lesson?
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| Author | Topic: A fun lesson? |
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Silver Lyon Posts: 363 |
posted 06-30-2005 03:48 AM
  
Can anyone guess what is special about this Madeira label? IP: Logged |
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Scotia Posts: 125 |
posted 06-30-2005 06:56 AM
Well, if the makers mark is "DF", it doesn't appear in Jacksons. If the date is 1832, I would have thought the duty mark would have been William IV? IP: Logged |
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salmoned Posts: 336 |
posted 07-01-2005 04:36 AM
Yes, that would be odd Scotia, but what if it was marked in 1792/3? Then the duty mark is correct. Also, I believe Grimwade's would be the best reference concerning the maker. I suspect what is unusual will be related to the obverse of the piece. [This message has been edited by salmoned (edited 07-01-2005).] IP: Logged |
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agleopar Posts: 850 |
posted 07-07-2005 08:52 PM
As a classless yank who knows knothing about "wines", how about a bald guess that Madeira was not made when this was sent to the Hall...? IP: Logged |
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wev Moderator Posts: 4132 |
posted 07-07-2005 09:17 PM
Madeira has been drunk at least since the mid 1500s. It was used for the official toast at Washington's first inaugural party -- bottle of that age still exist (if one has such tastes and very deep pockets). IP: Logged |
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agleopar Posts: 850 |
posted 07-10-2005 06:52 PM
ahem, yes, well I'll just stick to making silver and leave the wine and fun "historic" silver puzzles to the pros... Looking forward to the answer! P.S. Is it just the photo or is there gilt....? IP: Logged |
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Paul Lemieux Posts: 1800 |
posted 07-11-2005 10:34 AM
I give up. IP: Logged |
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wev Moderator Posts: 4132 |
posted 07-11-2005 03:35 PM
I've no idea; let's have the answer IP: Logged |
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Silver Lyon Posts: 363 |
posted 07-12-2005 07:52 AM
This is in fact a piece of 22carat GOLD! Marked for:London 1792. DF as you will have gathered is a problem but likely to be Daniel Field, a gold worker, who by 1792 worked in Hitchin, Hertfordshire. Before 1798, when the alternative 18ct was introduced, all gold assayed in England had to be 22 ct. and was marked with the lion passant as a standard mark in an identical fashion to silver pieces. So look VERY carefully whenever you see a piece of Georgian silvergilt! - you never know. IP: Logged |
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Scotia Posts: 125 |
posted 07-12-2005 09:30 AM
Well, that's a surprise! They must be very rare. The chances of finding such a piece being sold as silver must be slim as surely the weight is very noticeable. IP: Logged |
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Silver Lyon Posts: 363 |
posted 07-12-2005 11:26 AM
Good point. You'd be surprised tho'. Most c.18th. small gold pieces that I have handled are not sufficiently different to notice - even snuff boxes. But I agree that a gold milk jug should be self-apparent. About 20 years ago a cased 1763 gold cup was sold in Christies in London as Silver-gilt and only noticed by two dealers (who had the sense to buy the piece in partnership!) - It was heavy, but so are many really good quality pieces of silver. IP: Logged |
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agleopar Posts: 850 |
posted 07-12-2005 03:06 PM
This is going to sound out of place but a month ago at a yard sale with little of intrest and two rooms of less intrest, in the second room which I almost did not go in there on a table were 4 spun Juleps, 4 small 11/2" brandy snifters, tiffany, silver gilt and a small 8" three footed London pie crust Georgian salver that I guessed was 1780! All were bought for $40, $40 and $85. The salver turned out to be 1731, the juleps were still spun and the Tiffany gilt snifters when I got my glasses on and was giving them a polish, realized that I could not find a sterling mark... but what was that very faint 14 something! Yes they were14K! As to the weight they felt like the usual good solid Tiffany, the only real difference from sterling is the most delightful solid bell like ring they make when you tap them together . Thanks for another fun post Silver Lyon. [This message has been edited by agleopar (edited 07-12-2005).] IP: Logged |
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asheland Posts: 935 |
posted 07-12-2005 10:05 PM
Great find! Can you post a picture of the salver? asheland IP: Logged |
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agleopar Posts: 850 |
posted 07-12-2005 11:37 PM
Ashland, I will when I figure out the techno stuff (maybe SL will give me pointers!). IP: Logged |
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Silver Lyon Posts: 363 |
posted 07-13-2005 04:13 AM
SL is HOPELESS at the techno stuff - it was Scott's great patience that enabled my trembling fingers to post pictures - like all computer stuff it isn't quite so complicated once one has done it a few times! Ask Scott - he is really brilliant at guiding nervous paws! IP: Logged |
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Paul Lemieux Posts: 1800 |
posted 07-13-2005 01:35 PM
I can't believe some things people find at yard sales. Literally all I've bought at yard sales this year is a CD player for my car. I do know that many of us, myself included, would like to see pictures of the Tiffany gold pieces. IP: Logged |
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agleopar Posts: 850 |
posted 07-13-2005 03:26 PM
I will try to make the effort and overcome my forteenth century veiw of life... please be patient. IP: Logged |
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adelapt Posts: 418 |
posted 07-18-2005 12:39 PM
Silver Lyon - Thanks for your always interesting, always informative excursions into the byways of English silver and gold. The light you throw on the lesser known aspects is very welcome and a delight to read, and seems to be the result of a deep knowledge, readily shared. Thanks again. Adelapt. IP: Logged |
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Silver Lyon Posts: 363 |
posted 07-18-2005 12:54 PM
Comments like those above (however undeserved) make it all the more worthwhile to make the effort - Thanks!  IP: Logged |
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