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In this Forum we discuss the silver of the United Kingdom, as well as British Colonial silver and Old Sheffield Plate. Past British - Irish Sterling topics/threads worth a look. |
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In this Forum we discuss the silver of the United Kingdom, as well as British Colonial silver and Old Sheffield Plate. Past British - Irish Sterling topics/threads worth a look. |
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 SMP Silver Salon Forums
 British / Irish Sterling
 ? HENRY TUDOR Marks
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| Author | Topic: ? HENRY TUDOR Marks |
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wendlekins Posts: 50 |
posted 07-23-2005 11:57 AM
  
I have been told that this old Sheffield plate mark might be Henry Tudor. Has anybody any ideas? Many thanks, IP: Logged |
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PhilO Posts: 166 |
posted 07-24-2005 01:07 PM
Wendy, your piece is not Sheffield plate - it is sterling, assayed in Sheffield. I am pretty sure that it's not Henry Tudor & Co as that first letter looks too much like an "I" rather than an "H". I think that it's actually "IL&Co" for John Love & Co whose mark was entered at the assay office in 1783. The date is either 1784, 1785 or 1786, but I can't make the letter out sufficiently well to pin it down any closer. We can be certain that it's one of those dates because of the "incuse head" duty mark. If I was forced to give an opinion I think I would probably plump for the 1786/87 "k". What is the mark on? It would be nice to see the whole piece as early Sheffield silver is fairly rare. Phil IP: Logged |
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wendlekins Posts: 50 |
posted 07-24-2005 04:00 PM
Hi Phil, That is great help, Thank you. The piece is actually a beaker and I think it has a silver rim with a plated interior !!! It has a nice incised monogram HAM. I think you are right about the K now you have told me it is sterling. I think the maker could be IP & Co for John Parsons. What do you think ??? Best wishes IP: Logged |
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PhilO Posts: 166 |
posted 07-24-2005 05:53 PM
No, I can't see a "P" there, and Parsons & Co's mark was not entered until 1793. IP: Logged |
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wendlekins Posts: 50 |
posted 07-25-2005 09:05 AM
Many thanks again.  A great help. IP: Logged |
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swarter Moderator Posts: 2920 |
posted 07-25-2005 12:24 PM
What is the shell made of? It appears to be horn, as the lip - where the silver folds over - looks too thin to be wood. I would guess a vessel of this type to be a fairly rare survivor. IP: Logged |
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wendlekins Posts: 50 |
posted 07-25-2005 12:42 PM
Hi there, The shell is made of Horn. I would think it is fairly rare from this date but probably the lining has helped to keep it strong. The other examples I have seen have only had the silver rim or just horn alone. IP: Logged |
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salmoned Posts: 336 |
posted 07-25-2005 02:55 PM
I wonder why you think the lining is plated? Perhaps, it was gilded? I think it would be forbidden to use the sterling mark on the rim if the interior were only plated. IP: Logged |
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wendlekins Posts: 50 |
posted 07-25-2005 03:29 PM
I see what you mean. The dealer I bought this from said the whole piece was plated. I thought I could see copper beneath at the rim but now I look closely it might be gilded. The edge has worn in places. Could the discoloration be from the horn? Here is a picture of the edge. Thank you for your help IP: Logged |
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PhilO Posts: 166 |
posted 07-26-2005 02:13 AM
It was in order to prevent pieces made of mixed metals being passed off as all silver that the assay offices marked each individual slver part; for example teapot base and lid even if they were joined by hinges. In this instance there is a case for suggesting that the lining should also have been hallmarked if it was sterling. But perhaps it would not have been possible because of the shape and nature of the interior. IP: Logged |
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