posted 03-05-2005 07:25 PM            

A while back I inquired regarding the number sauce or gravy ladles as were typical for a given number of place settings of Georgian era table silver. One response informed me that the items about which I was inquiring were not sauce or gravy ladles, but were in fact toddy ladles. This got me to thinking (often a dangerous enterprise) as to what are the characteristic differences between sauce (including gravy) ladles and toddy ladles. From the resulting deep research into this question, I distilled two functional definitions, as follow.

1. If it's English or American, it's a sauce ladle; if it's Scottish or Irish, it's a toddy ladle. (This supports the contention that real Scot-Irish men don't eat gravy, limiting their intake to a higher octane form of "sauce"!)

2. If you're a buyer, it's a sauce ladle; if you're a seller, it's a toddy ladle.

#1: 15.6 cm length, 4.2 cm bowl width, 0.8 cm bowl depth, ~0.6 oz.

#2: 16.1 cm length, 5.0 cm bowl width, 1.6 cm bowl depth, ~0.9 oz.

#3: 17.0 cm length, 5.5 cm bowl width, 1.1 cm bowl depth, ~0.7 oz

#4: 16.9 cm length, 6.1 cm bowl width, 1.6 cm bowl depth, ~1.2 oz.

#5: 14.7 cm length, 4.3 cm bowl width, 1.5 cm bowl depth, ~0.8 oz.

#6: 16.3 cm length, 5.5 cm bowl width, 1.9 cm bowl depth, ~1.2 oz.

Any and all opinions/guesses welcome.

posted 03-07-2005 06:14 PM            

But the notion that a toddy laddle is considerably longer than the ordinary sauce laddle makes perfect sense. I'd go a bit further and say that a sensible one also has either a non-metallic handle or a non-metallic piece inserted in the handle to insulate it.

posted 03-16-2005 05:01 PM            

As for the 'toddy', palm juice may be where the name comes from but today the term normally refers to a less exotic commonly available liquor.

Nihon, may I add another challenge to your ladle research? Here is a link to one that puzzles me. Is this a 'Bateman Patent Bend' or what do you think? It may be a legitimate shape but it does look a bit unusual to me.

quote:

---

Antique English silver Toddy ladles. Period Georgian silver, "Bateman silver",Georgian Silver Toddy Ladle made by Peter,Ann, and William Bateman, London England, silver hallmarks date this piece from 1802 to 1803. This period English Georgian Toddy ladle is truly unique. The original Bateman silver hallmarks are clearly visible in one of the photographs we have shown. This silver toddy ladle measures 8 inches long by 4 and one quarter inches high. The silver bowl measures 4 and one eighths inches wide by 3 and one quarter inches deep. Period English Georgian Bateman ladles are very rare.

---

posted 03-16-2005 09:41 PM            

As for the latest example - a solution to the handle-slipping-in problem, I imagine.

posted 03-17-2005 02:56 PM            

In use, the terms carry meaning. Outside of use, they serve no good purpose. One can use a gravy or sauce ladle for toddy - then calling it a toddy ladle is proper, and vice versa.

posted 03-17-2005 03:51 PM            

Nihon,
" ... no real difference between a solid silver "toddy" ladle and a "sauce/gravy" ladle..". If you put the emphasis on 'solid silver' then maybe I'll go along. But only to the extent that you can use a solid silver gravy ladle to slowly fill the mug with toddy. On the other hand, what I would consider a credible toddy ladle, i.e. one with a usefully long handle (min. 12") would look awkward sitting in your average gravy boat of 3" depth. To my mind a shorter toddy ladle is a mislabeled gravy ladle.

posted 03-19-2005 07:03 PM            

#1: Prolific maker and mark-sharer W.PITKIN of East Hartford, Conn., and H.C.ROBINSON (unidentified, retailer?).

#2: That notorious duty dodger, Wm. Jamieson of Aberdeen. Did he get hanged?

#3: C.A.BURR of Rochester, NY.

#4: Sarah and John Blake of London.

#5: Robert Keay of Perth, Scotland.

#6: Unidentified, possibly Wm. Cummins (or Wm. Crouch?) of Dublin, Ireland.

posted 12-16-2018 01:52 PM            

A month or two ago I bought a "Georgian sauce ladle with a wooden handle" because the price was too good to resist. It's about 6 1/2 inches long. I recently found a Georgian punch strainer, so we decided to serve Georgian punch for New Year's Eve. I looked through my ladles for a period-appropriate serving implement and turned up the "sauce ladle." Its handle is not wood but baleen ("whalebone"), which makes a good handle for something meant to serve hot liquids because it's waterproof and doesn't conduct heat. Examining the marks on mine more carefully, I find it's by Elizabeth Morley, who took over the family business after her husband died and worked under her own name c. 1794-1807.

Throughout the 18th and 19th centuries, punch (both hot and cold) and "toddy" (a hot alcoholic beverage that might be synonymous with some forms of punch) were served in little 2-oz wine glasses, so a small ladle would have been appropriate. However, my Morley ladle holds only about 1/2 oz, and when I tested it with a correctly sized glass, it took 3 ladles full to fill the glass, which seems a bit inefficient. A similar ladle I've had for many years--unmarked, presumably British silverplate--is slightly bigger and filled the glass in 2 scoops.

The National Museum of Women in the Arts has an Elizabeth Morley ladle very similar to mine, half an inch longer, which they call a "toddy ladle."

Here's a photo of my Morley ladle (the smaller of the two pictured), the unmarked ladle, a glass of the size (though not quite the design) that toddy/punch would have been served in, and a pencil for scale:

posted 12-19-2018 10:59 AM            

When I bought it, I didn't know exactly what it was, but knew it's age from the hallmarks and was intrigued. I have since then gained an appreciation for the scarcity of these and understand why it fetched so much.