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Author Topic:   Recognize the maker?
Polly

Posts: 1970
Registered: Nov 2004

iconnumber posted 08-17-2011 05:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Polly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I recently bought very distinctive c. 1870 cream and sugar set. It has no maker's mark, but you guys were so successful at telling me who made my ladle last month that I'm hoping someone will have similar instincts about this set.

It's so heavy and well made that I'm convinced it must be by one of the important makers of the period.

The style is that very angular, arms-akimbo post-Christopher-Dresser shape that shows up more often in silverplate than sterling. I would expect the engraving to be Japonesque/Eastlake birds, bugs, and fans, but it's not--it's more 1860s-ish geometric.

I can't decide whether the sugar bowl is missing its lid or whether it never had one. Any guesses?

They're both marked 38 (I assume the model number) and 925 STERLING. They have some other numbers scratched in the bottom, presumably by some earlier owner. The dot in the middle of the bottom means they were raised, not spun, right?

Thoughts, anyone? Many thanks!

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Polly

Posts: 1970
Registered: Nov 2004

iconnumber posted 08-17-2011 05:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Polly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The mark on the other piece:

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Polly

Posts: 1970
Registered: Nov 2004

iconnumber posted 08-17-2011 05:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Polly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Creamer: [IMG]

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Richard Kurtzman
Moderator

Posts: 768
Registered: Aug 2000

iconnumber posted 08-17-2011 10:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Richard Kurtzman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Most likely William Gale.

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Polly

Posts: 1970
Registered: Nov 2004

iconnumber posted 08-17-2011 11:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Polly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thank you, Richard.

Why do you think William Gale? Not doubting you, just trying to learn.

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Richard Kurtzman
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Posts: 768
Registered: Aug 2000

iconnumber posted 08-18-2011 04:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Richard Kurtzman     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Polly,
Please see these threads.

There is some confusion with Ford & Tupper but I lean toward Gale.


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agleopar

Posts: 850
Registered: Jun 2004

iconnumber posted 08-18-2011 10:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for agleopar     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi Polly, beautiful! Just wondering if you see the over strike of the sterling in the first image of the bottom? I mean it looks like there is a T... something under the sterling mark? Actually maybe under the 925 also? Can you make it out or am I just imagining it?

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Polly

Posts: 1970
Registered: Nov 2004

iconnumber posted 08-18-2011 11:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Polly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Interesting! Thank you.

I tried searching for 925 sterling, but I got a zillion threads--everything about 925 or sterling. I can't figure out how to search for the exact phrase. Putting it in quotes doesn't seem to do it.

In one thread you mention Gale's date marks. Can you say more about those?


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Polly

Posts: 1970
Registered: Nov 2004

iconnumber posted 08-19-2011 01:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Polly     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hi, Rob. Your post just showed up for me. (My previous post was answering Richard.)

The overstrike is just 925 STERLING again, upside down. They struck it twice in the same place, but they turned the punch over the second time for some reason. (Is that the right word--punch?).

Is that another clue somehow? It seems like a weird thing to do.

Anybody have any thoughts about whether there was supposed to be a lid to the sugar bowl? My guess is yes, and I wish I had it!

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agleopar

Posts: 850
Registered: Jun 2004

iconnumber posted 08-19-2011 08:34 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for agleopar     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
It is not so uncommon to make mistakes when one is marking finished work. It is a persnickety job at best and fraught with chances to go wrong, double strikes, crooked and upside down if you are rushing or not paying attention.In this case it looks like the 38 was already on and the sterling mark was then put on upside down. It would be very hard to get "out" the mis-struck mark so easier to just to turn it around and strike it hard the right way.

The center punch could be there for raised or spun. These would have a very complex puzzle chuck if they were spun so most likely they were raised.

I do think this style and level of design would have had a lid on the sugar but I am only guessing.

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